Spiga

Enge Advaiti ?

முழுமை - முழுமை => ப்ரஹ்மம் = மாயை ?

And that was one more 'excellent' episode I must say, the 'Enge brahmanan' episode aired on 05-20-09. This is one other program I closely follow after Lollu sabha and the likes. Oh wait, is this one not included when I say the likes ? :P

Serious talks apart, the fun factor in this specific episode was quite high that it made me literally roll on the floor with laughs. Mr. Cho Ramaswamy while explaining the nature of Brahmam and the Atman(though not explicit enough) goes on to quote the advaita mahAvAkyas of
tat tvamasi, aham brahmAsmi
etc. The point here Sir, is that neither do I have an issue with you quoting them or using the advaita interpretations of them but please do so in another program titled "Enge Advaiti" for not every brahmanan is an advaiti and I totally disagree with advaitic interpretations for that matter.

The reasoning he gives to explain the mAyAvAda interpretations of advaita go as follows.
ॐ पूर्णमदः पूर्णमिदं पूर्णात्पूर्णमुदच्यते |
पूर्णस्य पूर्णमादाय पूर्णमेवावशिष्य्ते॥

om purNam adaH purNaM idaM purNAt purNaM udacyate |
purNasya purNaM AdAya purnaM evAvaSishyate ||

ISAvAsya upaniSad

So this is how the explanation(advaitic interpretation/Mr.Cho's explanation) goes,
pUrNaM(fullness, plentiness) as a character of brahmam means that the only case when pUrNam - pUrNam != null is when the pUrNam is mAyA(mithyA as per advaitic terms) (i.e) there is abundance when you remove an abundant world from the abundant brahmam only when both are mithyA/mAyA.


Now come my questions and refutations to the Mr. I-know-everything,
  1. Layman's refutation: Ever heard of this simple computation that says Infinity - Infinity = Infinity and not zero, Infinity + Infinity = Infinity and not 2 * Infinity ?

  2. sAmpradAyika refutation:
    satyam ~gnAnam *anantam*(Infinite) brahma - Taittriya Upanishad - Brahmananda valli - 1
  3. This supports my point when I say pUrNam - infinite. And thus ananta brahmam would gladly satisfy what is said in ISAvAsya upaniSad.


And further, one question that arises in me is, as an advaiti/mAyAvAdi how do you explain pUrNatvam of brahmam when the entire advaitic philosophy is rooted on a nirguNa brahmam and not a saguNa brahmam like viSishtAdvaitam ? You basically are doing nothing but marketing a flawed product. It is your product and you have your own reasons/rights to market it but not in the wrapper that you are using right now. I've been following the program since it started and I'm sorry to say this, but it is high time you renamed the program into "Enge Advaiti" instead of "Enge Brahmanan".

As, U.Ve.Sri SrIvatsangAchAriAr rightly points out, seems there are only three kinds of good advaitins in this world, a dead advaitin, an unborn advaitin, and a chitra advaitin and you stand out as an excellent example of the same Mr. 'Cho' Ramaswamy. Hats off on the achievement.

To watch the specific episode and my comments on the page, go here or use the embedded player below.




6 comments:

  Mosh

5/23/09 6:47 PM

This post has been removed by a blog administrator.
  Sriram Murali

5/23/09 7:07 PM

Mr. Ritwaj, may be I might have to shut my ass for crapping around wonderfully as per your *scholarly mind*, but one thing is for sure. Neither do you know what is discussed nor do you have the brains to analyze what is said. As for removing your comment, I would prefer my blog to be clear of your dirty farts and do understand this, adding a :) is never going to make anyone think that you took things in a lighter/intellectual sense. Get a life you loser. Is this not the second time you had issues with my ideas ?(If you are Mr.Ritwaj Ratan from EDULIX) and if I knew it was you who commented, I could quite easily have predicted what you would have commented. If you do want to know how a *learned* person who knows the intricacies of what is discussed, replies/discusses the crux of the post do see my scrapbook(Again, if you indeed are Mr. Ritwaj Ratan). Grow up child, you have a lot to learn. :P

  gautham krishna

5/24/09 2:25 PM

stirring the hornet's nest eh... :)
the inherent beauty of hinduism is its ability to accept and tolerate discussion, and thus creating various forms and principles(ok, philosophies). i am happy that my religion is not dogmatic, doctrinaire and is very accomodating. we cannot agree with everybody all the time, it is simply not human. :)

but nice blog. and that kavithai gundar, not bad eh??

keep writing, and cheers.

gautham

  Lakshmi

7/4/09 7:29 AM

We have to accept that different views always exist. The purpose of Cho is not propogation of advaitham; He has to follow his Acharya; that is all.
Only Easavasya upanishad has been written commentary by Swami Desikan.
I have read somewhere Shankara did not accept Eashavasya upanishad.
I am very eager to know address or telephone number of Srivathsangar.
If you have please mail me.
Lakshmi Sridharan. sridharanlakshmi@yahoo.com.

  Anonymous

7/7/09 2:26 PM

muzhumai - muzhumai = zero? Haha...awesome! What is god? Paal somba? Paala edutha vudane empty aagarthuku? LOL...nalla comedy :D And so this world is an Illusion? Maya? Oh come on! Take a look at the sunset this evening or the storm clouds sometime...if you dont see god you are blind :) He is here all over the place...is that an illusion too :D

It is not necessary with an infinite source. The whole creation can come from a benevolent, infinitely 'resource'ful creator, who can be his creation and yet not of it.

- Vyadha

  Kaushik

8/3/09 4:40 PM

Sriram,
I must admit I am not a competent enough person to debate with you about Advaita. However, I too, like you, felt "Enge Brahmnan" was quite crude and lacked the finesse we would love to see in something supposedly as momentous as this. However, it must be said to Cho's credit that he is barely trying to wipe away some of the needless/negatively portrayed stereotypes of us Brahmins (Iyer/Iyengar) in today's society (including Tamizh Cinema). Yes, I agree it would irk VishishtAdvaitins like you (as also less-informed Advaitha followers like me) that he portrays Brahmins (in general) as followers of Advaita Philosophy, under a single umbrella. But we must, again, remember that when (most) non-Brahmins (and a lot of ignorant/by-birth Brahmins) don't really know half as much about the meaning in our practices/customs, they would know still lesser about DvaitA, AdvaitA and VishishtAdvaitA. And like M(r)s.Lakshmi Sridharan says, Cho's intention was not to propagate AdvaitA, just to give a meaningful explanation to our practices and highlight the purposefulness of Brahminism, that is all. That he happened to be an Advaitin resulted in the answers being the way they are. If he had tried to do justice to all 3 types, then the answers wouldn't have made half as much sense as they do now (how much ever they make sense now :P).
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The more perfect you attempt to do something, the more awry it goes, in today's increasingly imperfect world. Kamal's (usual) movies are a classic example of this.
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In case it helps, here's an analogy - What Cho tried to do was bring the ignorant Junta (including Brahmins) to the higher pedestal that the Brahmanan (as opposed to Brahmin) of yore was supposed to stand on. Those of us who are trying to emulate this Brahmanan are often ridiculed today, by people far below (brahmins/non-brahmins). Once on top of this pedestal, how we see the truth is the 'issue' between Dvaitins, Advaitins & VisishtAdvaitins, best left unexplained until one comes up the pedestal. Until then, sticking to one method of helping someone climb is better than trying to explain what rope is being used to do the same, and what are the other ropes available to do it. At least Cho is somewhat competent in the rope he uses.
Sorry if I sodhappified in trying to explain more clearly.
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On a lighter vein, I used to feel irked every time non-Brahmins referred to Brahmins as "Airre", whether they were Iyers or Iyengars. :D